Forum archives » Regarding Stripcreator » Comments on comics, yay or nay

Brad
August 11, 2005 7:08 AM

Do we want the ability for people to post comments underneath comics? This has been a requested feature for years and I'm finally motivated enough to do it. Keep in mind:

- You would be able to turn off commenting (or maybe restrict it to donor-only or something) in your user preferences.

- You would be able to delete any comments you don't like on your comics.

- There will probably be a flag to report trollish/abusive behavior.

There are definitely a lot of potential downsides to this feature, but I think there are some very positive upsides. Like getting new users to participate without them having to join the forums, etc.

Anyway, I'd like to hear some opinions on this feature if you've got any.

Post #184989link

evil_d
August 11, 2005 7:28 AM

If individual strippers can turn off or delete comments on their own comics, then I can't think of any objection to this feature.

Post #184990link

attitudechicka
August 11, 2005 8:10 AM

I think it's a great idea.
Can we comment on our own comics? Sometimes it's nice to add a story that accompanies a comic and instead of having a seperate place for author comments and other user comments, we could put them all there.

Post #184991link

mandingo
August 11, 2005 8:26 AM

i REALLY like this idea. but i don't like that you can delete comments. thats the point of comments is seeing what people liked and what they didn't. how representative is it if someone can delete everything that isn't complimentary?

at the very least i think donor comments shouldn't be able to be deleted

Post #184992link

Brad
August 11, 2005 8:53 AM

quote:
I think it's a great idea.
Can we comment on our own comics? Sometimes it's nice to add a story that accompanies a comic and instead of having a seperate place for author comments and other user comments, we could put them all there.

You would definitely be able to comment on your own comics and that'd be another added benefit. I think people often want to talk about what inspired their comics.

Post #184993link

Brad
August 11, 2005 9:00 AM

quote:
i REALLY like this idea. but i don't like that you can delete comments. thats the point of comments is seeing what people liked and what they didn't. how representative is it if someone can delete everything that isn't complimentary?

at the very least i think donor comments shouldn't be able to be deleted



I can't think of any good reason that people should have to put up with comments they don't like on their comics. Who cares if all the negative feedback gets deleted? And I expect different authors will have different thresholds for what they're okay with.

Post #184995link

mandingo
August 11, 2005 9:52 AM

not to be an argumentative dickwad on a cool new feature, but that makes sense from the comic maker side but what about the viewers? that would be half the fun for me is seeing what people think of other people's comics. suggestions they make on how to improve it. but thats completely gone if i know that people can tailor the comments. then it isn't really so much comments by users, but comments that happen to agree with the comic maker. undercuts the validity of the feedback imo. plus, you said you have a seperate feature that will get rid of 'trollish' comments, so that would take care of all the ones that should be deleted anyway

Post #185003link

attitudechicka
August 11, 2005 9:55 AM

quote:
quote:
i REALLY like this idea. but i don't like that you can delete comments. thats the point of comments is seeing what people liked and what they didn't. how representative is it if someone can delete everything that isn't complimentary?

at the very least i think donor comments shouldn't be able to be deleted



I can't think of any good reason that people should have to put up with comments they don't like on their comics. Who cares if all the negative feedback gets deleted? And I expect different authors will have different thresholds for what they're okay with.

I thought about this issue as well. I think everyone's got their own personal limits. Some people would only save the compliments (which, if the comic is really that bad, there may not be any which is a good indication that they're deleting them), others will delete some from people who they have a personal grudge against, and others may just delete ones that they simply don't agree with, and either which way it's nice to have the option so that your comments on one comic aren't flooded with "J00 SUXXORZ!!11!!111!!" (Which I fully intend to delete any comment where numbers are used where letters should be, or containing any of the following "LOL", "LMAO", "ROFLMAO", "OMG", and possibly "lewl" if used too often)

Post #185004link

HCRoyall
August 11, 2005 10:07 AM

It's too bad there isn't a "Stupid" filter. But despite the negatives, I'd rather not be able to delete the comments.

Post #185005link

Brad
August 11, 2005 10:13 AM

quote:
not to be an argumentative dickwad on a cool new feature, but that makes sense from the comic maker side but what about the viewers? that would be half the fun for me is seeing what people think of other people's comics. suggestions they make on how to improve it. but thats completely gone if i know that people can tailor the comments. then it isn't really so much comments by users, but comments that happen to agree with the comic maker. undercuts the validity of the feedback imo. plus, you said you have a seperate feature that will get rid of 'trollish' comments, so that would take care of all the ones that should be deleted anyway

Well, I think you're jumping to the conclusion that just because users have the power to delete comments that they won't allow anything vaguely negative in. I expect "YOU SUCK AND ARE UGLY" comments to get deleted and am fine with that. "Good opening panel! I think this comic could have been funnier with this punchline:" however is pretty polite and constructive and I'd expect only the most sensitive would object to it.

There would be a "report this comment/user" feature. But this would be for outright abuses. Flooding, spamming, trolling, death threats, etc. There are roughly 300,000 comics on the site. That's 300,000 individual pages that any user could comment on, which is probably more than I and the moderators would be able to realistically supervise.

That's the big thing holding me back right now.

Post #185007link

Brad
August 11, 2005 10:15 AM

The other issue is even if I allow authors to delete comments, what happens with authors like say Max, who aren't around anymore? Is it just open season on his comics?

Post #185008link

mandingo
August 11, 2005 10:33 AM

quote:
I expect "YOU SUCK AND ARE UGLY" comments to get deleted and am fine with that.
but those would be deleted under the trollish feature anyway, wouldn't they?

quote:
The other issue is even if I allow authors to delete comments, what happens with authors like say Max, who aren't around anymore? Is it just open season on his comics?
you could set it so that by default comments are off. then all the long gone comic makers would be untouched. that would reduce the fun of commenting on like Cowboy Physics though. maybe it would have to be a self regulated thing where people who enjoy Cowboy Physics and other older comics would report the abuse for him

Post #185011link

KajunFirefly
August 11, 2005 11:57 AM

quote:
The other issue is even if I allow authors to delete comments, what happens with authors like say Max, who aren't around anymore? Is it just open season on his comics?
Yeah, that was going to be my point. How about all accounts have the option set to "do not allow users to comment on my comics" as a default?

-- edit
I see mandingo has just suggested this, damn you, mandingo!
-- /edit

I can't think of any valid argument against being able to delete comments from your own comics. There are many people on this site who make comics for a very small audience, or a very specific audience. We've all come across a user who has comics that are about people we've never heard of. Why would this user need a whole bunch of comments or advice from people they don't know and for that matter, don't want to know? I might suggest a better punchline for a comic only to find out I've missed some in-joke on the alt.hamster.duct-tape message boards or something.

I wouldn't mind hearing what non-forum users think of my comics, but I wouldn't want all my comics tarred with negative comments just because my forum persona is pretty antagonistic. Negative comments in your user info page is fair game. It's on a seperate page, but the main comic page is the whole point of this site, it's your own little special part of the site and you can make it look just the way you want. It'd ruin the whole idea if people could just stick comments all over it without you having any control. I would even delete a comment that said "THIS IS THE FUNNIEST COMIC EVAR!!!".

Anyone who was around for the short-lived "create-a-strip" will remember how this feature was mercilessly abused by various SC Crusaders.

Post #185014link

NeoVid
August 11, 2005 12:17 PM

quote:
If individual strippers can turn off or delete comments on their own comics, then I can't think of any objection to this feature.

Hey, he's right!

Post #185015link

mandingo
August 11, 2005 12:31 PM

quote:
-- edit
I see mandingo has just suggested this, damn you, mandingo!
-- /edit
mwa ha COUGH

furball

quote:
There are many people on this site who make comics for a very small audience, or a very specific audience. We've all come across a user who has comics that are about people we've never heard of. Why would this user need a whole bunch of comments or advice from people they don't know and for that matter, don't want to know?
they could just turn it off though, right?

quote:
Negative comments in your user info page is fair game. It's on a seperate page, but the main comic page is the whole point of this site, it's your own little special part of the site and you can make it look just the way you want. It'd ruin the whole idea if people could just stick comments all over it without you having any control.
all you'd have to do is not have ratings show up on your homepage. only show up when you're at the url of the individual comic

another idea is to maybe have the feature where you can turn off ratings on individual comics. i like the other way better though, plus its probbly alot easier to script

Post #185017link

squidrabies
August 11, 2005 1:05 PM

I think it's a great idea. If people want to be pathetic and delete everything they don't like, I say let them. I'd leave anything up, I don't care. My comics are funny to me, and someone posting, "This comic sucks, go die" wouldn't make anyone enjoy the comic less. I think not letting people delete comments would end up with about 10 people with commenting turned on.
I agree you should set it to "no comments" by default. As far as commenting on old stuff you like where the creator has gone away for good, maybe you could talk Brad into turning certain users' commenting to ON if you promised you'd keep an eye on them in case of spammers. Okay bye!

Post #185019link

KajunFirefly
August 11, 2005 1:18 PM

quote:
quote:
Negative comments in your user info page is fair game. It's on a seperate page, but the main comic page is the whole point of this site, it's your own little special part of the site and you can make it look just the way you want. It'd ruin the whole idea if people could just stick comments all over it without you having any control.
all you'd have to do is not have ratings show up on your homepage. only show up when you're at the url of the individual comic

another idea is to maybe have the feature where you can turn off ratings on individual comics. i like the other way better though, plus its probbly alot easier to script


Well, that wasn't the point I was making, it's a personal choice. If you don't want comments on comics, turn them off, if you want them, turn them on. If your comics become littered with comments that you don't like, delete them. I can't honestly see any valid argument against giving the users more control over what happens to their comics.

What if you posted a comment on my comic saying "the punchine would work better if the boorite character was saying it", then I take your advice and edit the comic. Should I be stuck with your now-redundant comment?

Post #185021link

KajunFirefly
August 11, 2005 1:21 PM

quote:
what happens with authors like say Max, who aren't around anymore? Is it just open season on his comics?
Didn't we already establish that you were Max?

Post #185022link

mandingo
August 11, 2005 2:14 PM

quote:
I think it's a great idea. If people want to be pathetic and delete everything they don't like, I say let them. I'd leave anything up, I don't care. My comics are funny to me....
exactly. i'd leave everything up too. they're user comments. what they say is their opinion. what's the point of allowing user comments if they're goin to be filtered by the comic maker? all your learning about is the comic maker, not the community's opinion of the comic

quote:
I can't honestly see any valid argument against giving the users more control over what happens to their comics.
but your taking control away from those who post comments. so its really not about more control for users, but how you distribute the control

quote:
What if you posted a comment on my comic saying "the punchine would work better if the boorite character was saying it", then I take your advice and edit the comic. Should I be stuck with your now-redundant comment?
i think other people could figure that out pretty easily. or you could do an option where the original comic maker can comment on any comment made (giving them the last word since its their comic)

but now i'll pull a boorite, though less cool, and say i raised my flag and whoever wishes to salute it with their dick may do so

Post #185034link

KajunFirefly
August 11, 2005 2:31 PM

quote:
but your taking control away from those who post comments. so its really not about more control for users, but how you distribute the control
Who cares if someone deletes your comment? It just means they either didn't appreciate it or treated it like a PM message and deleted it once read. If you like them, keep them, but I don't think the balance of power should favour the comment maker.

Personally, I would have the comments turned on and would like to be able to leave comments on my own comics (to maybe save a narration panel explaining that the comic is a true story that happened at work or something). Although I would be quite irked if the comments on one of my comics had turned into a mini-forum of people discussing my use of the word "ass".

quote:
i think other people could figure that out pretty easily. or you could do an option where the original comic maker can comment on any comment made (giving them the last word since its their comic)
So now you have two comments, both cancelling each other out, both redundant. What is so wrong with being able to delete the comments?

Post #185039link

mandingo
August 11, 2005 2:52 PM

quote:
Who cares if someone deletes your comment?
quote:
What is so wrong with being able to delete the comments?
if you read above you'll see i'm saying what's the point reading user comments if you know the comic maker can filter them to make them say whatever he/she wants

Post #185043link

KajunFirefly
August 11, 2005 3:00 PM

quote:
quote:
Who cares if someone deletes your comment?
quote:
What is so wrong with being able to delete the comments?
if you read above you'll see i'm saying what's the point reading user comments if you know the comic maker can filter them to make them say whatever he/she wants
I say we wait until the comment system comes into effect and if such an example arises we deal with it then. I'm not exactly sure what you mean, it's not like people are going to be putting words into your mouth. If we left the deleting of comments to the moderators, I forsee many a "well, it wasn't technically a trolling/flaming comment, so I think my personal rights have been violated" argument.

Post #185046link

Brad
August 11, 2005 5:23 PM

I don't think I'm going to change my mind about authors being able to delete comments posted to their comics. The task of moderating would be too huge without that and I'd rather not implement the feature at all.

mandingo, you're very passionately arguing the worst case scenario of everything and it's not at all helpful.

Maybe some authors will delete anything vaguely negative, but that will almost definitely be a tiny minority.

Maybe some people will feel that if their comments can be deleted, why should they bother posting anything at all. But that again will probably be a tiny minority.

Millions of people have weblogs with open comment systems and they don't all ruthlessly delete anything vaguely negative.

And your comments can be deleted on any open forum on the internet (including Stripcreator), but that stops almost nobody from participating.

Post #185064link

mandingo
August 11, 2005 6:14 PM

quote:
mandingo, you're very passionately arguing the worst case scenario of everything and it's not at all helpful.
i could just as easily say to you that you are arguing the worst case about commenters and there even being a need to delete comments. why don't i? because i don't need to belittle your opinion to make my own known

quote:
mandingo, you're very passionately
actually i'm not very passinate about this at all. i was giving an opinion because the title of this thread made me think you wanted them. i'll appreciate the feature regardless of how its added

now if you'll excuse me i'm goin to go have a little chat with wall2

Post #185066link

AccentuateNegative
August 11, 2005 7:08 PM

No surprise here, I agree with Brad and Kajun. Here's why:

This account of mine has the greater potential to have comments I dislike posted to my comics. If someone posts, "Gay sex is disgusting," it might not be considered trolling since it isn't a personal attack and it probably relates to the content of the comic. Well, I've heard it all before and I write the comics to entertain myself most of all and my friends secondly. I don't make the comics to create a forum for people who happen to disagree with homosexuality for whatever reason and I'd rather not have it pollute my creative output.

In this thread you said of three of my comics, "they were fun to read in an expose kind of way, but not particularly funny to me." That isn't the kind of comment I'd trash, even if all you said was you didn't think they were funny. It's an honest assessment of the strips.

If I got negative comments frequently, I'd probably turn them off; but if it's only the occasional comment I don't like, I'd like to have the ability to delete it. As a moderator, I'd be able to delete comments anyway, so I'm giving an example of why someone might want to delete certain comments from their comics--maybe it will be a 14 year old girl who wants to show her parents a comic she made about school, but doesn't want them to see some R-Rated comment made below it.

Post #185070link

Drexle
August 11, 2005 8:12 PM

Instead of simply having it to where comments are either turned on or turned off, perhaps you could set it to where comments are considered invisible until approved by the comic author. It's just a difference between prefering to make things selectively visible vs selectively invisible. Also, I really think there needs to be some kind of notification system so that you know when someone has commented on you and to which strip they have commented.

I don't see anything wrong with people using it strictly to show off positive comments. Comments only have as much value as you want them to, kind of like stars or comic ratings.

Post #185072link

Externalization
August 11, 2005 10:41 PM

Just checking in to say I support this idea, regardless of whether or not the comments are deletable.

Post #185094link

KajunFirefly
August 11, 2005 11:51 PM

quote:
quote:
mandingo, you're very passionately arguing the worst case scenario of everything and it's not at all helpful.
i could just as easily say to you that you are arguing the worst case about commenters and there even being a need to delete comments. why don't i? because i don't need to belittle your opinion to make my own known
Would it make you feel better if there was an option for the commenter to delete their comments? That way you could stop someone from tailoring their comments to suit themselves, although I'm not sure that's likely to happen, ever.

What I'm more worried about is why someone would be so determined to have their comment, negative or otherwise, be made permanent.

Post #185102link

Injokester
August 12, 2005 1:16 AM

I love the idea.

I also agree that we should be able to delete comments. Nothing sucks more than seeing stupid flames everywhere.

Post #185105link

Matchbook_Romance
August 15, 2005 10:35 AM

quote:
Just checking in to say I support this idea, regardless of whether or not the comments are deletable.

Aye, captain.

Post #185322link

cpausti
August 15, 2005 7:29 PM

Sounds neat. I say do it.

Post #185340link

Chaplin
August 16, 2005 3:38 PM

I'm a brownnoser so I think anything Brad says or does is perfect.
Go whatever this forum is about!

Post #185385link

kramer_vs_kramer
August 17, 2005 7:24 AM

quote:
Anyone who was around for the short-lived "create-a-strip" will remember how this feature was mercilessly abused by various SC Crusaders.

I miss that site, some of the comments on it were fantastic even if the comics weren't.

Post #185449link

BigFrank105
August 18, 2005 11:03 PM

Do eet! Do eet now!

Post #185573link

arbi
August 19, 2005 8:52 AM

Good plan. I've been vaguely toying with the idea of learning how to save my comics, and put them in a blog,
penny arcade style, with buttons for merch, info about the annal convention etc. Not got around to it.
This would add a lot of that functionality.

Comment spammers will always be trying to stay one step ahead of the game. Example: Max2 turns comments on, but then gets bored/dies horribly, and his comments fill up with spam. Your current proposed method is an "alert a moderator" button, and maybe that's enough. But I was thinking you could (if this is easy enough to do) have a setting that resets comments to off after a (month, year, period of time) of no new comics.
-----
Dear Ms. Mandingo,
My Name is Mr Emma Sankho a credit and finance manager with African Development Bank here in Dakar Senegal. In my department i discovered an abandoned funds (USD$ 20.5 million) in an account that belongs to one of our foreign customer (MR. ANDREAS SCHRANNER from Munich, Germany) who died along with his entire family in July 2000 in a plane crash.

Since i got information about his death, I have been expecting his next of kin to come over and claim his money because we cannot release it unless some body applies for it as next of kin or relation to the deceased as indicated in our banking guidlings and laws but unfortunately we learnt that all his supposed next of kin or relation died alongside with him at the plane crash leaving nobody behind for the claim.
It is therefore upon this discovery that I now decided to make this business proposal to you and release the money to you as the next of kin or relation to the deceased for safety and subsequent disbursement since nobody is coming for it and we don't want this money to go into the bank treasury as unclaimed bill.
The banking law and guidline here stipulates that if such money remained unclaimed after Six years, the money will be transfered into the bank treasury as unclaimed fund. The request of foreigner as next of kin in this business is occassioned by the fact that the customer was a foreigner and an Indigene cannot stand as next of kin to a foreigner.
Your percentage will be declare to you as soon as you indicate your interest. I will visit your country for disbursement according to the percentage indicated once you have agreed to get this fund transfered through your account.
Therefore, to enable the immediate move of this fund to you arranged, you must apply first to the bank as relation or next of kin of the deceased indicating.
1.Your full name and address
2.Your telephone and fax number for easy communication.
3.Your company's name and address.
Upon receipt of your reply, I will send to you by fax or email the text of the application .
I will not fail to bring to your notice that this transaction is hitch-free and that you should not entertain any atom of fear as all required arrangements have been made for the movement of the money.
You should contact me immediately as soon as you receive this letter.
Trusting to hear from you immediately.
Contact me on this email;emma_01@walla.com

Yours Faithfully,
EMMA SANKHO

Post #185580link

attitudechicka
August 19, 2005 9:15 AM

quote:
Dear Ms. Mandingo,

There's a Ms. Mandingo? Or was Mandingo a girl all along?
quote:
My Name is Mr Emma Sankho
after all this guy has a woman's name as a first name...

Post #185581link

mandingo
August 19, 2005 1:55 PM

quote:
quote:
Dear Ms. Mandingo,
There's a Ms. Mandingo? Or was Mandingo a girl all along?
last i heard i was a black lesbian ethiopian. i'll keep you updated

Post #185591link

Forum archives » Regarding Stripcreator » Comments on comics, yay or nay

stripcreator
Make a comic
Forums
featuring
diesel sweeties
jerkcity
exploding dog
goats
ko fight club
penny arcade
chopping block
also
Brad Sucks