well i think the assumption is that god transcends the universe, existing outside of spacetime, so saying he/she/it has always existed is a divide by zero proposition

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what if nigger meant kite

I don't know why "the universe came from nothing, as far as we understand 'nothingness' at least" is so much harder to accept than "an infinitely powerful, knowing, and existent (but for some reason totally unperceivable) being made it".

If God can exist outside space and time as we understand them and therefore be beyond even our concept of infinity, then why is it so inconceivable that a bunch of impersonal matter also came into being as we understand it from these same realms outside of human perception?

Why does a force have to be sentient in order to achieve the apparently impossible?

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This signature has performed an illegal operation and has been shut down.

Now I know why I always get that DIV/0! error when doing formulas in Excel. It's God's fault!

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Think classy, you'll be classy.

that's basically my take on it too. the universe "came to be" through some process no more sentient than photosynthesis or a wiggling flagellum

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what if nigger meant kite

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I don't know why "the universe came from nothing, as far as we understand 'nothingness' at least" is so much harder to accept than "an infinitely powerful, knowing, and existent (but for some reason totally unperceivable) being made it".

If God can exist outside space and time as we understand them and therefore be beyond even our concept of infinity, then why is it so inconceivable that a bunch of impersonal matter also came into being as we understand it from these same realms outside of human perception?

Why does a force have to be sentient in order to achieve the apparently impossible?

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Just to get it back to politics for a bit. People have the misconception that Democracy is simply about majority rule. It's not. The American constitution is specifically set up to avoid the "tyranny of the majority." That is (as least in terms of our basic rights) the majority can't abridge the rights of the minority. So the majority can't vote to pick a national religion because the constitution specifically forbids it.

I can't say it always works that way, but that it the ideal.

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...Trot and Cap'n Bill were free from anxiety and care. Button-Bright never worried about anything. The Scarecrow, not being able to sleep, looked out of the window and tried to count the stars.

Yeah, in theory, democracy is about finding the best solution for everybody.

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This signature has performed an illegal operation and has been shut down.

But in theory, so is anarchy.

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"Jelly-belly gigglin, dancin and a-wigglin, honey that's the way I am!" Janice the Muppet

GOP upset about leaks all of a sudden. Not like when they meant to leak an agent's name.

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"Jelly-belly gigglin, dancin and a-wigglin, honey that's the way I am!" Janice the Muppet

They're only upset because they got busted.

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Think classy, you'll be classy.

In case you didn't see it in your news. In my state of CT, a local mayor lost his primary but won the election as as write in.

http://www.wtnh.com/Global/story.asp?S=4093390

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...Trot and Cap'n Bill were free from anxiety and care. Button-Bright never worried about anything. The Scarecrow, not being able to sleep, looked out of the window and tried to count the stars.

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In case you didn't see it in your news. In my state of CT, a local mayor lost his primary but won the election as as write in.

http://www.wtnh.com/Global/story.asp?S=4093390

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In case you didn't see it in your news. In my state of CT, a local mayor lost his primary but won the election as as write in.

http://www.wtnh.com/Global/story.asp?S=4093390

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Playing at a Unitarian church near you!

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"Jelly-belly gigglin, dancin and a-wigglin, honey that's the way I am!" Janice the Muppet

Wheee...my first post in DSMP, and only the second time I've read this thread. I got this from the governator today.

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From: governor@govmail.ca.gov
Sent: Tuesday, November 15, 2005 1:23 PM
To:
Subject: Re:Gender-neutral marriage.AB00849

Thank you for emailing to express your position regarding Assembly Bill 849 (Leno). I understand the importance of this piece of legislation and the outcome it would have on our State and nation as a whole. After extensive consideration and thorough deliberation from proponents and opponents of this issue, I have decided to veto this bill.

I am proud California is a leader in recognizing and respecting domestic partnerships and the equal rights of domestic partners. I believe that lesbian and gay couples are entitled to full protection under the law and should not be discriminated against based upon their relationships. I support current domestic partnership rights and will continue to vigorously defend and enforce these rights and as such will not support a rollback of these rights.

California Family Code Section 308.5 was enacted by an initiative statute passed by the voters as Proposition 22 in 2000. Article II, section 10 of the California Constitution prohibits the Legislature from amending this initiative statute without a vote of the people. This bill does not provide for such a vote and I do not believe the Legislature can reverse an initiative approved by the people of California.

The ultimate issue regarding the constitutionality of section 308.5 and its prohibition of same-sex marriage is currently before the Court of Appeals in San Francisco and will likely be decided by the Supreme Court. If the ban of same-sex marriage is unconstitutional, this bill is not necessary. If the ban is constitutional, this bill is ineffective.

While I was not able to sign this bill in particular, I did sign legislation to extend the rights of domestic partners. Last legislative session I signed SB 1234 (Kuehl), the most comprehensive extension of domestic partner rights. This session I signed AB 1400 (Laird), which clarifies that marital status and sexual orientation are among the characteristics that are protected against discrimination by business establishments under the Unruh Civil Rights Act. I also signed AB 1586 (Koretz) which adds additional language to already existing anti-discrimination provision to clarify that State law prohibits insurance companies and health care service plans from discriminating on the basis of gender in the creation or maintenance of service contracts or the provision of benefits or coverage.

Thank you again for taking the time to voice your opinion. Taking the time to communicate your opinions and concern shows that California's people are engaged in issues that affect the well being and future of our State.

Sincerely,

Arnold Schwarzenegger

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Speaking from experience, I can say evolution is more science than faith. I had the great (mis)fortune of getting to go to a high school that taught creationism.

I just couldn't understand why they didn't like it when I read books on evolution during class. Silly me. Shoulda known science class is for religion.

Sorry I didn't notice this before, DX.

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Conclusion: Democrats as a group are smarter than Republicans, but that's still not saying much.

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*ahem* so in otherwords, believing in creationism is stupid?

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Good, that.

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"Jelly-belly gigglin, dancin and a-wigglin, honey that's the way I am!" Janice the Muppet

I'm sure everyone has seen this, as I have a million times, but I enjoy it. It's a Benny Hill W Bush cartoon skit.

Benny Hill

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I dumb :D

Ive got a question, and Im too lazy to google the answer, so I figure Id let you guys do the legwork. Its about the US elections. What the hell is a primary? And who gets to vote in these? And why is New Hampshire always an important one, I know its got something to do with how the Democrats and republicans choose who is going to run for president, but Ive never really understood the process

New Hampshire is the first one of the season. Other than that, it sounds like you understand as much about the process as I do.

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What others say about boorite!

i actually went and researched it, just for you. (i accept all forms of payment)

it seems the way it works is that each state is given a number of delegates proportional to its population. then all 50 states hold a primary. then whoever wins that state's primary gets that state's delegates. (most states actually have it so if one guy wins 60% of the vote and another guy 40%, then the guy who won 60% gets 60% of the delegates and the guy who won 40% gets 40% of the delegates)

then all the delegates from all the states go to the national convention and vote for the candidates they were assigned. then whichever candidate has a majority of the delegates wins the nomination for president. the interesting part comes in when the delegates vote and find that none of the candidates have a majority. then they barter and make deals and vote and revote until they do

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what if nigger meant kite

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Legend, oh legend, the third wheel legend...always in the way.

Fun read...

http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/opinion/2002630307_lance18.html

And another thing, I read that the info was bogus within 8 hours of Powell's speech to the UN. How could congress and the white house not know?

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"Jelly-belly gigglin, dancin and a-wigglin, honey that's the way I am!" Janice the Muppet

Pat Robertson has the outgoing Dover, Pa. School Board confused with God. Voters ousted all eight members earlier this month for sticking "Intelligent Design" into the science curriculum. Said Robertson, "don't wonder why He hasn't helped you when problems begin, if they begin. I'm not saying they will, but if they do, just remember, you just voted God out of your city."

No, they just voted eight medeival theocrats out of their school board. As far as I know, God wasn't even on the ballot.

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What others say about boorite!